Shifting to non-consumers and its impact on consumer

adalosadalos Posts: 12
We have suspended consumer sales on our website to focus on our backlog. Currently we have no plans to bring back consumer sales. The delivery of Kickstarter and pre-order units in the US will continue as planned.


I know this has been a rough couple of days for the international community, but it hasn't exactly panned out well for the US consumer either. Let me preface this by stating that I don't have an Omni and am pretty far back in the pre-order list. I'm really concerned about the utility of a consumer Omni based on the recent shift to target arcades (and Chinese ones at that) combined with the Virtuix statement above of no plan of future consumer sales.

If the Omni is going to be restricted to foreign arcades, that doesn't bode well for the several thousand consumer Omni users for a couple reasons:
  1. Consumer (non-arcade) game developers will have little/no reason to consider Omni utilization in their game
  2. Potential Omni consumer network limited to several thousand owners, severely limiting community driven game mods/work-arounds
  3. Despite what has kind of been hinted at, there really is no connection between arcade games and PC games, so any development in the arcade game world around the Omni will have no transferable value to consumers
So if this is indeed the path forward for the Omni, I wonder if there is value in continuing to wait for those of us who pre-ordered. As I don't own one yet, I'm not clear as to how much community support there is, aside from what I have read on these forums, regarding the use of the consumer Omni in legacy/future AAA games. For example, I typically play open world RPG and FPS games (Skyrim, FarCry, etc.). I want to do so in a manner that allows for tracking my body movement (directional walking/crouching/jumping), head movement, and accessory movement (aiming with a gun/swinging a controller).

Even as a pre-order, this is still a significant investment, especially when paired with the need for a VR headset and controllers. I haven't bought the latter because I have no interest in room-scale VR and like the solution the Omni provides of unlimited space, but not if it means limited use in legacy/future games and no game development for consumers.









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Comments

  • SlopeySlopey Posts: 23
    edited December 2016
    Indeed - my company makes VR training solutions for industry, we're moving into Unity/Unreal VR games off the back of that, and I'd have bought several Omnis if the Kickstarter one had ever arrived and was of reasonable quality. In fact, we have an office in Houston, as well as the UK, and it would be entirely possible for me to turn up at Virtuix's office with a flat bed to pick up the unit, however I have no desire to do that given their attitude.

    But anyway - the platform is now effectively dead. There'll be some "experiences" which will support the Omni for sure - like their TRAVR stuff and the kind of mini games you get at arcade experiences for 2-5 mins, because that's where their market now is.

    You can forget integration with the Omni for any consumer titles - so you're stuck with Vorpx, which if you've not used VR yet (according to the above), you're going to be largely dissapointed with in most cases.

    No consumer means no reason for anyone to support it. It also dispenses with hobbists doing Unity/Unreal games with it (why bother with so few units), and destroys a community of evangelists who had been hanging in for the product for 3.5 years. So I would suggest that you'll get your unit, but it'll be useless beyond the Virtuix demos which natively support or which you can hack into working with VorpX.
  • DanteMDanteM Posts: 171
    Basically don't expect much in the way of support in AAA games .. like none at all.

    However you can still use it as a movement controller for running around the game world which is going to likely be the best function with the abundance of VR mods for headset and movement decoupled functions. The whole internation thing is excluding a massive amount of potential buyers and modders. I know that I myself plan mostly to use the Omni on games like Skyrim, FarCry, Doom, Battlefield etc most FPS games and open world RPG's as a movement controller. There are a lot of VR mods that allow for a decoupled movement for controller and headset use which the Omni can piggyback off in controller/legacy mode basically. I'm just happy that I'll still be able to get my Omni heck maybe even sooner I'm hoping that a majority of the firt 600 backers were international and not USA based haha, terrible thing to hope for but hey trying to make the most of the situation lol.
  • adminadmin Posts: 148
    Let me jump in here and make a comment. A small consumer market of a few thousand Omni users, or even a few ten thousand, is never enough for a game developer to justify developing for a hardware platform. Consumers are currently willing to pay $10-$20 for a VR game (perhaps $40 in some cases), but those are one-time sales. However, in the commercial market, players line up all day long in malls and gaming centers to pay $10 or even $20 just for a 10-minute experience. The revenues are currently much higher in this market, and by sharing some of these revenues with game developers, game developers currently can make much more money in the commercial VR market than in the consumer VR market. As such, we are currently working with more than 20 game developers that are making games, or part of their existing VR game, available to the commercial market. At the same time, we assure that these VR games are compatible with the Omni also for our consumers. As a result, we actually end up with many more VR games that work with the Omni.
  • GreyAcumenGreyAcumen Posts: 308
    edited December 2016
    @admin -
    I've been as supportive as possible on the whole international issue, but if you're shutting down sales to individual US based consumers, then you need to pull your head out of your ass. Developers don't NEED to develop entire games exclusively for the omni, many existing VR games can include a minor update to benefit from including support for the omni, in the meantime they can still sell the game to people who don't own the omni, but they can basically guarantee sales to omni users with just a minor addition to their already developed game, they could even make it a paid DLC, the same way some devs are adding paid DLC for the VR functionality. It's a bonehead move to stop sales to consumers because YOU don't think there will be a market. Of course there's not going to be a market if you don't provide units to consumers, but that's entirely your fault then.

    Games that are designed for arcades are **** experiences compared to games designed for home use, because all of them revolve around creating a small repeatable experience that certain types of people (not me) will be willing to play over and over again. This leads to one of 2 things: "games" that have no actual content and are literally just there for the experience of VR, and "games" that are nothing more than leaderboard whoring.
    I play games to become involved in WORLDS and STORIES, and the "developers" that will be "profiting" from your arcade focus aren't going to have any incentive to develop in these directions at all. There are already numerous VR experiences that would benefit from the inclusion of Omni support, like Path to Thalamus, Skyrim(with VorpX), Doom, Windlands, etc, and not a single one of these games could possibly work in an arcade setting, where players are constantly under a time or life limit.(and in the latter cases, the games are ALWAYS specifically tweaked to be ridiculously easy to lose lives in) Developers may need to profit, but for VR to become a viable platform, there need to be experiences that showcase what VR adds to an experience, and that innovation and creativity doesn't come from **** arcades, it comes from independent developers who are designing games for their own fulfillment and making money is just icing on the cake. The same thing is true for the Omni, but if indie devs can't get get a hold of an Omni to test their work on, and if doing so would only let them target an arcade (which may be completely unsuitable for the type of game that they've made) then it isn't even hyperbole to say that you WILL be killing the market for any seriously GOOD VR development to take place for the Omni.

    I'm a kickstarter, and a pathfinder, and I've been constantly offering support and feedback on these forums ever since I found them. With all that in mind, please understand that I am telling you outright that if you're going to insist on sticking to arcades and no longer accepting further consumer level orders, that I am going to be demanding a refund that I be allowed to put the unit up for resale. I'm perfectly fine with putting a temporary halt on consumer sales until the current list of preorders and arcades can be dealt with, but if you make that permanent, I'm out, because that goes against everything I intended to support when I funded this project.
    I am not saying this lightly either. I still have high hopes for the potential of the Omni and how it can benefit VR, and I've greatly enjoyed all the time I've used it, and I'm sure that trying to settle for Vive's room scale experience is only going to leave me dissatisfied, but those benefits, the benefits I want to see, will never be realized through a focus on arcades. Hell, arcades don't typically sell their games to consumers, so how would I even get ahold of any of these amazing games being developed for arcades, on MY omni, assuming they were even worth my time?

    You stick to this decision and I really do have a giant **** useless art deco piece taking up a huge chunk of my room that could be going towards space for room scale instead.

    ps. I kept the box the Omni came in. Maybe I'll contact Gaben like I had suggested before, if I can't get any reliable buyers.
  • SlopeySlopey Posts: 23
    edited December 2016
    admin said:

    Let me jump in here and make a comment. A small consumer market of a few thousand Omni users, or even a few ten thousand, is never enough for a game developer to justify developing for a hardware platform. Consumers are currently willing to pay $10-$20 for a VR game (perhaps $40 in some cases), but those are one-time sales. However, in the commercial market, players line up all day long in malls and gaming centers to pay $10 or even $20 just for a 10-minute experience. The revenues are currently much higher in this market, and by sharing some of these revenues with game developers, game developers currently can make much more money in the commercial VR market than in the consumer VR market. As such, we are currently working with more than 20 game developers that are making games, or part of their existing VR game, available to the commercial market. At the same time, we assure that these VR games are compatible with the Omni also for our consumers. As a result, we actually end up with many more VR games that work with the Omni.

    So there we have it. The focus was never on consumers at all. Here's the true game plan for Virtuix at last.

    Consumers with Omnis in their house don't want to play 5-10 minute arcade experiences - they are by definition limited and linear. Even something like Space Pirate Trainer wouldn't work in an arcade environment without a time limiter in case you get someone on it who can go up to Lvl 100 and occupy the unit for an extended period of time, limiting utilisation. You'll end up with many more VR "games" which work with the Omni, but they likely won't be released commercially for consumers, because as your Australian distributor already says - these are uniquely commercial experiences - that's the main USP - why go to the arcade to play this if Bob has it at his house. So all these experiences are irrelevant as far as a non-commercial Omni owner is concerned.

    When I backed, I was interested in using the Omni for traversing open world games, and building my own games/worlds with Omni support in Unity/Unreal, not play (any number) of limited arcade experiences.

    Ok - so you're a commercial entity, and you need to make money, and obviously if you can sell Omnis for $1000 plus a cut of the player fees at an arcade, that's better than providing what you said you would to a $500 kickstarter backer, but how you have gone about it is shameful imho.

    If you'd posted a few months ago saying there were problems with the weight, and problems with the support, and engaged in consultation with backers, even to the point of requiring an additional top-up-fee, and pitching the unit as not a consumer unit but a sample or similar (which I believe you could have done to still comply with EU regulations), and letting us pay for our own shipping, or choosing to take a refund at that point, along with a frank explanation that the only future you saw for Virtuix was commercial, there would have been far more understanding. As it was, you negotiated these agreements behind the backs of the kickstarters (these agreements don't happen over night), and then unilaterally cancel everyone's non-US orders while simultaneously your partners in China/Oz advertise exclusive commercial opportunities. It's an object lesson in how not to do it.

    Anyway as you confirm above, unless you want to play short arcade style experiences, and that's if you can even buy them, your Omni is now useless beyond VorpX style wrappers.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    will get over 800$ refunded and some space in my home. Put me in the waiting line if you are selling yours.
    I will pay for shipment.
    It will probably end up as deco in my garden, but at least I can tell "i got one"
  • sutekiBsutekiB Posts: 1,032
    Hi @Slopey, the developers who are working with Virtuix have big plans - these are not throwaway titles and include the likes of World War Toons, The SoulKeeper VR, Affected, Serious Sam, The Bellows, Xing: The Land Beyond and many others. Besides that, arcade games often have great replay value. I still play the PS1 Ridge Racer (I keep the disc in my PS3), and that only has one track. It was ports of arcade games like this that made the PS1 era consoles so popular in the home. Let's hope that a vibrant VR arcade market and development scene will have the same effect, spurring home adoption of VR hardware. I expect that content will also be made available to Omni owners, as this won't discourage people from going to the arcades.

    I know this is very painful, but it's not just Virtuix that can't survive if it only supplies the enthusiast market. The numbers aren't there for most content developers either. If the enthusiasts on this forum can continue to show the same support for Virtuix that they have done for years, the company can work to bridge the gap between the niche enthusiast market, and the mass consumer. That will benefit everyone! I don't think this can happen if the VR experiences on offer continues to stagnate with 'stand-in-place' / teleportation-based wave shooters. As enthusiasts with a grand vision, we imagine a sea-change in the way the world plays videogames, and we want it to happen right now - but in practice that's a very difficult thing to do.

    We can eventually get to the point where the Omni is available outside of the U.S. Even big companies don't always launch their product globally all at once - so imagine how hard it is for a small start-up! Sales of the Omni to the consumer could resume - but we don't know when, and we don't know if the hardware will need to change in the meantime, and so the refunds are necessary. It would be wrong to keep hold of people's money in the meantime, since how long that will take is unknown. Of course this is extremely demoralising after waiting so long and getting hopes raised - there's no way this would be planned way in advance. VR is still a very volatile industry and you just can't make these kinds of decisions right at the outset. I get that people are mistrusting now, but this is a crowdfunded company that feels a great devotion to its community, and everyone is pretty down at the moment knowing how much anguish this is causing.

    Let's stick together through this, and keep the dream alive. This whole community has the power to change things, to influence others for the better, whether we have Omnis yet or not. Your opinion matters, so please don't let this unfortunate turn of events sour your opinion of Virtuix, or the Omni.
    Community Manager at Virtuix
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    it is like punching somebody in the teeth (or elsewhere) and then saying "nothing personal"
  • giroudf said:

    it is like punching somebody in the teeth (or elsewhere) and then saying "nothing personal"

    That is true, unfortunately.
    --------------------------------------
    Cheez\/\/iz
    Omni Backer #40!
    Rift Backer #2,770 (That was a good one!)
    Middle Tennessee
    --------------------------------------
  • adalosadalos Posts: 12
    That's cool, but I think a lot of your consumer base is more like me and not looking to use the Omni as an arcade experience, so most/all of those games have little interest to us.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    edited December 2016
    yep, if you have been through the rift dk1, dk2 and above, you probably got already all the wow effect from these little demos.
    And paying 10 or 20$ for the five minutes experience with stinky shoes and sweaty headset fom the previous 50 users in the line, no thanks...
  • Nossforra2Nossforra2 Posts: 84
    edited December 2016
    I truly belive Omni is going to refocus on gen 1 as a commercial product and start developing a gen2 for consumers. The technology has changed drastically since the introduction and refinement of gen 1 omni. The use of existing tracking systems in HMD'S offers an opportunity to actually develop a product that loses all of the electronic components and half the size. Once again that's just my opinion as solely relying on a commercial product is not a long term solution. A consumer product evolves into gen2,3,4 commercial entities do not replace existing units often as evident by all of the old school mortal Kombat machines everywhere.
  • DanteMDanteM Posts: 171
    admin said:

    As a result, we actually end up with many more VR games that work with the Omni.

    Any game with a modding community can support the Omni thanks to Decoupled head and body movement mods intended for Oculus and Vive users with a controller. (most of those modders being UK and EU gamers)

    As for games that work and support the Omni it would make more sense to update the Omni's control functions to allow it to easier mimic controller input, WASD input, vive touchpad input to control movement in games that already support that type of controls .. basically all of them haha. ..... I think the Omni already does this if I'm correct? well minus the Vive touch pad control which I really hope gets added in an update for the software as it shouldn't be that had to add in. I mean I wrote my own script to make my WASD keys function as the Vive controller touchpad for movement in games like ONWARD as a test.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    edited December 2016
    without the kickstarter, the omni would not exist. It even failed at first kickstarter. It even failed as B2B at shark tank. and failed again with funding.
    They were lucky to get it done the 2nd time, because VR was the hype. Now it is gone, and they can come back with any offer they want, they will never succeed again.
    What promises could they do they have not done already (and did not keep). a cheap consumer version distributed worldwide ? that exactly was the omni.
    I find also very strange that a Chinese company did no purchase KATvr , another Chinese startup. their product was better.
    answer is simple. The world was at the reach of virtuix and they killed it knowing KatVR has no power to flood market worlwide as the omni could.


  • sutekiBsutekiB Posts: 1,032
    @giroudf Failed at first kickstarter? There was only one campaign and it was very successful.
    Community Manager at Virtuix
  • TomekTomek Posts: 76
    I'd like to at least get links to other products I could get to have my own VR treadmill.
  • SlopeySlopey Posts: 23
    edited December 2016
    sutekiB said:

    Hi @Slopey, the developers who are working with Virtuix have big plans - these are not throwaway titles and include the likes of World War Toons, The SoulKeeper VR, Affected, Serious Sam, The Bellows, Xing: The Land Beyond and many others.

    Is that before, or after Virtuix decided there will be no sales to consumers and persue an Arcade only format? Have you even told them officially? (that's easy for anyone to check btw).
    sutekiB said:

    If the enthusiasts on this forum can continue to show the same support for Virtuix that they have done for years, the company can work to bridge the gap between the niche enthusiast market, and the mass consumer.

    Unlikely seeing as Virtuix has shafted everyone who's a non-US kickstarter, and even then, with the pure commercial device going forward, devalued the product for US customers.
    sutekiB said:

    Let's stick together through this, and keep the dream alive. This whole community has the power to change things, to influence others for the better, whether we have Omnis yet or not. Your opinion matters, so please don't let this unfortunate turn of events sour your opinion of Virtuix, or the Omni.

    It's a bit late for that to be honest. Not delivering on a kickstarter after THREE AND A HALF YEARS, refund or no, sours my opinion of Virtuix, for obvious reasons.
    sutekiB said:

    @giroudf Failed at first kickstarter? There was only one campaign and it was very successful.

    Successful for who? As I'm not going to get the thing I backed in the campaign. I think this sums it up nicely - it was successful for Virtuix as a low cost, no obligation loan. For non-US backers, it's not been successful in the slightest.

  • GreyAcumenGreyAcumen Posts: 308
    edited December 2016
    sutekiB said:

    Hi @Slopey, the developers who are working with Virtuix have big plans - these are not throwaway titles and include the likes of World War Toons, The SoulKeeper VR, Affected, Serious Sam, The Bellows, Xing: The Land Beyond and many others. Besides that, arcade games often have great replay value. I still play the PS1 Ridge Racer (I keep the disc in my PS3), and that only has one track. It was ports of arcade games like this that made the PS1 era consoles so popular in the home. Let's hope that a vibrant VR arcade market and development scene will have the same effect, spurring home adoption of VR hardware. I expect that content will also be made available to Omni owners, as this won't discourage people from going to the arcades.

    Are you trying to convince us or yourself? Because I'm not buying it. Virtuix has big plans? Virtuix has had big plans with no grounding in reality before, I think we can all see how that has turned out. The only reason you have devs making games like soulkeeper "for the arcade" is because they already poured their resources into their game expecting to have consumer level support and the only other option they have is scrapping the project, which would ruin them.
    You should be more aware of the facts of the matter than anyone, Suteki. Which of your videos have the highest number of hits? I haven't even looked, but I'm betting it goes; "Skyrim, GTA, Minecraft, Something else like the first 3, then other stuff, etc" You didn't get your hits from playing Ridge Racer. Name even a single, just ONE actual exploration based adventure game that has EVER been made for an Arcade. Adventure is literally THE dream that drives VR; the ability to experience living another reality, NOT A SCENARIO.
    I dare you to even try to image what would happen to Skyrim in an arcade setting; character creation? too much time, remove other races and default to a generic Nord, The player wont see themselves anyway. Fight your first dragon? No, that wouldn't be happening, you wouldn't even time to get through the first Draugr tomb with the Golden Dragon Claw. Hell, in an arcade setting, you wouldn't have time to get out of Helgen, and that's only IF you rush through everything like you've done it a dozen times already. Shouts? too late in the story. Developing a unique strategy for playstyle? that's not until at least level 6-10 range. Yeah, that's some great goddamn Virtual world right there, too bad you'll be living your life in a tunnel. What good does it do to allow the player complete freedom to move through a limitless virtual world when the time they have to move through it limits them just as badly as room scale ever did?
    sutekiB said:

    I know this is very painful, but it's not just Virtuix that can't survive if it only supplies the enthusiast market. The numbers aren't there for most content developers either. If the enthusiasts on this forum can continue to show the same support for Virtuix that they have done for years, the company can work to bridge the gap between the niche enthusiast market, and the mass consumer. That will benefit everyone! I don't think this can happen if the VR experiences on offer continues to stagnate with 'stand-in-place' / teleportation-based wave shooters. As enthusiasts with a grand vision, we imagine a sea-change in the way the world plays videogames, and we want it to happen right now - but in practice that's a very difficult thing to do.

    That's absolutely correct, if Virtuix were to ONLY supply the enthusiast market, there would obviously be problems. I've got no problem with Virtuix focusing on an Arcade experience. What I have a problem with is Virtuix EXCLUDING the enthusiast market. Unless Virtuix allows people who are willing to jump in on the Virtuix platform early, there will NEVER be non-arcade games developed for the Omni.
    Why do you keep repeating the same fallacies about VR developers? Omni isn't financially viable to develop for? What the hell are you talking about? Windlands is a great game for VR. It would be even better with Omni support. The crazy thing? It's also pretty solid even WITHOUT VR. Developers DON'T need to rely SOLELY on the Omni userbase. They can make a game that is WONDERFUL on Omni, solid on VR, and still fun without either. Virtuix isn't doing the devs or the consumers, or even VR any favors by restricting the sales to those consumers who are still trying to put in their orders.
    Artephax said:

    I'll keep the details brief to protect the supplier. Basically I have had an international pre-order through Virtuix's website for 2 years. After hearing the news, I have been in communication with a local supplier to see if I can still get one. They have informed me that they have been forced by Virtuix to suspend all sales EXCEPT to commercial buyers (i.e. companies), and that the price of the Omni has been increased to ~$7000 per unit as instructed by Virtuix.

    @admin - you need to respond to this, and you need to respond to it now: Is Virtuix suspending US sales to consumers indefinitely or will they resume in the near future? The answer to that question is going to decide whether I will be keeping my Omni or not.
    Slopey said:

    sutekiB said:

    @giroudf Failed at first kickstarter? There was only one campaign and it was very successful.

    Successful for who? As I'm not going to get the thing I backed in the campaign. I think this sums it up nicely - it was successful for Virtuix as a low cost, no obligation loan. For non-US backers, it's not been successful in the slightest.
    That is a super valid point. Successful at raising money, yes. Successful at fulfilling the intentions that got that kickstarter funded in the first place? Not so much.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    about successful developpers for virtuix

  • @giroudf - without context, that image actually supports Virtuix's stance that the market isn't there for omni-supplemented VR, which implies that arcades are needed, so that people can see just what the omni adds to VR without needing to drop the full $1000+ investment down up front. All I'm seeing is a bunch of areas in Europe and Canada unable to attract the audience they were hoping for through regular consumers. Is that what the image was supposed to convey?

  • AscensiAscensi Posts: 116
    I think there is incentive for game developers to build games for the Omni as "exclusive" and add inexpensive subscriptions for arcades to keep them well funded and keep developing the title, make the story bigger. Personally I don't like good games where there is an ending -that means game over.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    edited December 2016
    all arcade games are game over either because you are to weak (time-out) or too good (lost of interest). But that is for cheap games.
    I do no think the omni arcade game will be a cheap one. so as arcade game it is poised to be either a big success or a total failure.
    @Greyacumen, the picture has many meanings
    One is that it look very hard to make money wth apps for the omni.
    But that's all releative, because you can understand that no kickstarter wants to invest into another kickstarter, while they did not get any returns from the first one (timing is all about kickstarter).
    The other one should tell that the VR-omni community is not so big or involved that they could support all these projects.
    Again it is all relative because you can also deduct that, if the omni is a niche, the kickstarter was pretty good at capturing all the interested people of that niche.
    (and all that for almost free)
    So pissing on them and expecting some success in an area where interest is just an hypothesis could be and dangerous bet also.
    I can understand virtuix when the choose the third way.
    They sold the omni to B2B and thus are not responsible to what happen to its implementation or result. They do not have to drive a community or manage thousands of customers or build an ecosystem around the product.
    It is a bit like selling weapons. You don't care who will use it and what they will do with it or the reason they have to purchase.
    They agree on the price and the quantity and pay upfront at delivery.
    If you are a kind of Geek, you probably know what happens to Peeble (the watch)
    the were on the edge to release the Peeble 2 when they sold the business to fitbit. apparently Fitbit is not interested to release the Peeble 2, they are just interested in the IP (intellectual property).
    Probably they have seeen some IP that let their lawyers sue Apple or samsung for billions of dollars.
    a much better choice than going to produce, sell and support a gadget to thousands of customers. Deja vu ?
    https://forums.pebble.com/t/goodbye-fun-while-it-lasted/26854
    http://arstechnica.com/science/2015/12/certain-customers-spell-doom-for-new-products/

    And what about samsung releasing a patch that will kill notes 7 still in the fiield.
    They will release soon a ptach that stop the device to charge battery. another expensive paperweight.
    http://www.theverge.com/2016/12/8/13892400/samsung-galaxy-note-7-permanently-disabled-no-charging-us-update
  • We have suspended consumer sales on our website to focus on our backlog. Currently we have no plans to bring back consumer sales. The delivery of Kickstarter and pre-order units in the US will continue as planned.


    I was curious about this comment as well. I interpreted this as Virtuix not planning to bring back consumer sales, period.

    If so, I seriously regret not placing a pre-order a few days before pre-orders were disabled.
  • SlopeySlopey Posts: 23
    According to Wang Kun, the development director of Hero; "Wang told us that their goal is to allow players to get the core experience of the game in less than 10 minutes' battle."

    Yeah - enjoy that content...... :D

    Source: http://2p.com/46388906_1/Hero-Entertainment-Talks-Virtuix-Omni-Price-Strategy-and-Games-by-Wei.htm
  • sutekiBsutekiB Posts: 1,032
    @Jayeckz No plans does not equate to not wanting to or never will!
    Community Manager at Virtuix
  • RABIDRABID Posts: 118
    sutekiB said:

    @giroudf Failed at first kickstarter? There was only one campaign and it was very successful.

    its not sucessful until it at least delivers.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    edited December 2016
    if i would an employee of Virtuix , i would worry too.
    Probably lots of jobs (all the technical ones) will be soon redundant or useless, since no more customers.
    (Hero has its own, and anyway will implement an already existing product on the omni).
    even this forum and website has no more reason to exist (except collecting our complaints).
    It is even full of lies and misleading people who could read it.
    among others:
    "Step into your favorite games and experience a whole new level of play. "
    the full page listing compatibles games http://www.virtuix.com/games/
    "We’ve heard many great ideas from our customers about how they will use the Omni to generate revenues for their business."
    so basically the kickstarters gave for free all theirs ideas to vituix ? IP problem here ?
    "The Omni can help you make simple but steady improvements in your health or even transform you into a gamer of the future:" medical assumption ?
    "The Omni comes with a 1-year warranty for home consumer use, commencing from the date of receipt of the product." ??????
    "Commercial use of the product will void any warranty right" ?????
    http://vr.petroldev.com/products/ still active , allowing you to preorder the omni for 699$



    They could as well replace it by a page with a picture of the omni and a big title under "Not for You !"
  • DanteMDanteM Posts: 171
    RABID said:

    sutekiB said:

    @giroudf Failed at first kickstarter? There was only one campaign and it was very successful.

    its not sucessful until it at least delivers.
    That's not true at all, from a kickstarter standpoint it is successful if they make or exceed the goal set on their campaign. What happens after has nothing to do with kickstarter.
  • giroudfgiroudf Posts: 127
    edited December 2016
    "they make or exceed the goal set on their campaign" that has not been done, or else you open a campaign for anything, get the money and deliver only to one kickstarter.
    the money from all kickstarter has been involved, so all kickstarters should receive the same treatment.
    What will happens if a swedish company open a kickstarter and finally said "no shipment to anybody out of Sweden since it is too difficult" ?
    and what about 90% of kickstarters where outside Sweden ?
    Basically it is a door opened to any abuse, and that's what Virtuix does.
    They could from the start make a kickstarter USA only, planning ahead for the shipment/support problem.
    But without international support , virtuix would not even pass the kickstarter stage.



  • sutekiBsutekiB Posts: 1,032
    It is unfortunate @giroudf that it was not known at the time of the Kickstarter that there would be so much difficulty in shipping and supporting the product internationally. So much has happened since then, it would have been impossible to foresee all of the challenges, though there was always some uncertainty as stated on the campaign page:
    Hardware is hard. Completing the manufacturing process will require time and resources.

    As Jan has said, "money can solve all problems, but the reality is that our resources are limited" - if there had been even greater investment it may have been possible for Virtuix to ship and support the Omni to all backers, all over the world. Sadly, the potential of VR, the problem of simulator-sickness, and the merits of the Omni are still not as widely recognised as they ought to be.

    It is a known risk with crowdfunded projects that they may run into difficulties. Luckily, in this case those difficulties did not extend to backers losing their money. The lengthy wait, time without access to the pledged amount, and disappointment are still deeply regrettable. However, I'd like to focus on the positives - the company is still in a strong position, it is producing the Omni, and I believe there is a route (as history has shown) from being a commercial-only product to becoming a viable consumer product. It's just going to take a bit longer than we all hoped. Let's keep the faith, and keep working hard towards that vision!

    Community Manager at Virtuix
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